- The late John McCain. The valve is at lower lifts twice every time it opens, but only at the peak once. Airflow Research developed these 185cc SBF Enforcer cylinder heads for maximum small block Ford performance. Today I bought 165's for my '65 289 and then transferred them over to my 347 when I built that. by David Vizard Tue Mar 01, 2016 10:27 am, Post Shopping for performance parts like you were looking through the Sears Christmas Wish Book while accepting the sellers claims of their product being the next best thing since sliced bread is not how "proper" engine build are done. So, you could have a nitrous'd, 8,000 rpm 302 on one hand or a 427 Windsor bumbling around on the street and be able to use pretty similar cylinder heads. Reviews I was told that the valve springs that come with the AFR 165cc Renegade heads are not compatible with the Crane roller cam I am looking at but was told that the 8016 springs are close to the #44308-1 crane springs. Are there other heads that you would recommend? Heads are designed for 5/16" pushrods, Larger pushrods will not fit without clearancing and is not recommended since some areas are very thin. The Competition Package is aimed at the exhaust side of the head, and is "a more detailed port," according to AFR. Said that the 8016 springs are 385 lbs @ 0.560" lift and the Crane springs calculated to . Speaking of which, what we tested were box-stock, standard-production 165 and 185 AFR heads. #1 Sorry kinda long. thanks. JavaScript is disabled. Looking forward to installing them on my turbo S. Additionally, by limiting the number of available options on this line of cylinder heads, AFR can further streamline the manufacturing process, keeping the prices in the realm of affordability. Reply Save Like kamloops67 The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. With lightweight 8mm diameter stem, 2.020'' intake valves, 1.600'' exhaust valves, volumes of 58cc, 60cc or 72cc combustion chambers, and 70cc exhaust ports, AFR's new 185cc Ford cylinder heads are designed for 302-367 cid engines operating from 1500 rpm to 6500 rpm. Click to reveal Period. AFR 165 SBF Renegade heads evaluation - Don Terrill's Speed-Talk . However, looking for an affordable middle ground, AFR came up with its new line of cylinder heads The Enforcer. Free Shipping - AFR 165cc SBF Renegade 20 Degree Street Heads with qualifying orders of $99. Please see footnotes for additional information. Requires supplied thermactor reducer (x2) to mount alternator/accessory brackets. Since you've already made 370 RWHP my fear would be you'd spend the money on 185s and not get satisfactory $/hp. They've been listed "Not In Stock" on their website for over a year now. Installation Note: 1986 5.0L must have pistons notched for clearance. Accessories, 185cc Renegade Street Aluminum Cylinder Heads. $2,064.27. May 23, 2020 No experience with those heads but for the same price I think I would give the As Cast AFR heads a try, since they used the same valves and parts as their more expensive heads. You can cut a man's tongue from his mouth, but that does not mean hes a liar, it just shows that you fear the truth he might speak about you! Msg & data rates may apply. injectors. How do you feel that these heads would work on an under 6000 rpm 351 in a heavy truck (4900 pounds)? We used it because we knew it too would not be a choke on the cylinder heads. Description. Those are the same components you get with our full-CNC cylinder heads.. The bare, straight-plug version will be part number 1002, while the fully assembled straight-plug head will be P/N: 1001. I built my 331 in 2004 and used '70 351w heads that I fully ported and unshrouded with 1.94/1.6 valves and with 160cc intake port and 60cc exhaust port. The port designs and castings are completely different than our full-CNC heads, Torrecarion explains. What type of question would you like to submit? To give us all an indication of how the 165 and 185 heads react, we ran a pair of each across our 347 test engine. The e-mail address that you entered is either incorrect or invalid. Also TW's revised valve angles from stock also provide additional p/v clearance. 185cc Renegade Street Cylinder Head Features: Thank you! Are they really that good? Even though these heads produce strong results as just a bolt on they are somewhat hamstrung because the valve events produced by the stock camshaft are way off what is typically suitable. The only changes to the engine were the heads, then jumping from a 70 mm throttle body to a 75 mm throttle body and then stepping up from some 24 lb. The 185s make notably more power on the top end and cost no power at all on the bottom end. Build your own custom newsletter with the content you love from EngineLabs, directly to your inbox, absolutely FREE! Intake Valve, 1.600 in. This allows AFR to offer a cylinder head with improved port designs and enlarged port volumes but without any of the expensive CNC porting or finishing work (other than the critical surfaces like the deck and valvetrain mounts). (**MOST, not all), 1969 Convertible field find (450hp spaghetti noodle). 1.7 shaft rockers and beehives. I remember hearing that 500 HP was pushing a stock block but maybe that was a 5.0 block and the older blocks were stronger. Recommended for engines from 302-393 cubic inches, operating up to 6000-6500 RPM. View Details I just remembered something. The question does remain, however, when considering engines less aggressive than our test mule. Just built another engine for my buddy with AFR 185's and a Trick Flow stage 1 cam. However, unlike the LS head, the SBF version features an adjustable pushrod guide plate. The 325cc intake runner flows 355cfm at .700-inch lift, and the Enforcer exhaust port actually outflows the 2101 port at .700-inch lift by 2cfm, proving the as-cast runners can perform with the big boys. Always interested in how things work, he enjoys sharing his passion for automotive technology with the reader. Come join the discussion about restoration, modifications, NOS parts, troubleshooting, VIN codes, and more! CNC time is too dear to waste on cutting excess metal you really shouldn't have poured in the first place, and because AFR is a small company with its own in-house foundry, it has separate castings for each head. From what I remember.. HP alone won't kill a 5.0 block,.. as HP+high RPM is what seems to crack them..". One is upgraded valves and springs for $180. So, without these heads sitting under heat lamps on the AFR counter, either coordinate with your dealer or get your order in early. Experience. I still have the stock cast iron heads and want to change that. We strongly recommend using 7/16" rocker studs with today's fast cam rates and RPM capabilities as 3/8" Rocker Studs can occasionally break. A forum community dedicated to vintage Ford Mustang owners and enthusiasts. Heads with 1.625" O.D springs will require some springs to be removed for access to some head bolts when installing the heads. The higher the rpm, the more air the engine uses. VerticalScope Inc., 111 Peter Street, Suite 600, Toronto, Ontario, M5V 2H1, Canada. If you spend time over on the Yellowbullet or Turboforums you will see a number of people running turbos on stock blocks at power levels that conventional wisdom says are not possible. Vintage/Classic/Historical Engine Tech, 3V Performance Engine & Valve train Development, Race Cars & Parts - For Sale or Wanted, Re: AFR 165 SBF Renegade heads evaluation, http://www.speedtalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=45080. So, if you have to wait a couple of weeks for a set of AFR heads, now you know why. Stud Upgrade 6411: 7/16 Rocker Stud (+$44): Spring Upgrade 8605: .650 Lift/7000 RPM Hydraulic Roller (+$95): Component Upgrade 8600: 7 Titanium Retainer (+$130): Scorpion Roller Rockers - SBF Stud Mount 3/8" x 1.6, AFR 6715 - SBF Tall Black Powder Coat Valve Covers. Come join the discussion about restoration, modifications, NOS parts, troubleshooting, VIN codes, and more! by bmcdaniel Tue Mar 01, 2016 3:38 pm, Post What gaskets do you recommend using with my RENEGADE cylinder heads? Estimated to ship direct from manufacturer on 07/03/23, pending manufacturer availability. The program tends to be a little optimistic, but that should give you an idea of possible gains. The SBF Enforcer uses the same premium-grade, chrome-silicon, 1.290-inch-diameter dual valvespring as the LS head. But, the main advantages of the Enforcer heads are that they are brand new versus used, and that they come with high-quality valvetrain components PAC Racing valvesprings, Viton valve seals, hardened spring cups, machine locks, ductile-iron seats, and AFR stainless-steel valves. Look to be a great deal. Post All flow in cfm; flow measured at 28 in. Bare (or No Parts in AFR vernacular) or fully assembled. Here is the specs of the Renegade AFR heads the produced 410 lbs-ft of torque and 431 hp from 306 inch (0.030 bore) using a 270 hyd roller cam and pump gas for fuel. AFR's NEW 185cc Renegade Ford cylinder head is a total redesign of their already formidable and proven 20 Ford cylinder head. The 195cc intake runner flows 251cfm at .600 inch of lift, while the 76cc exhaust runner moves 197cfm at the same lift. AFR's 185cc SBF Enforcer Cylinder heads feature our Permanent Mold "As-Cast" Technology surfaces on the intake runners, exhaust runners and combustion chambers that allows for extremely accurate and repeatable port location/performance. Write a Review, Write a Review As such, the question is when to switch from the bolt-on 165 to the higher-performance 185 heads? Exhaust flow is compromised at 0.550-inch lift as well, and both heads flow the same on the exhaust because both heads use the identical CNC-ported exhaust port and 1.600-inch valve. Clearly, if your engine has more camshaft, displacement, or rpm than our dyno mule, the 185s are the way to go. For those who know me, i've resisted the temptation to buy horsepower rather than "making" horsepower. freq may vary. 1968 Camaro RS/SS - no longer neglected - back on the road about spring of 2023? AFR 185cc SBF Competition Cylinder Heads 1426 - eBay or with mild modifications" by Comp, so it is not a big bruiser, but at the same time, it's definitely well ahead of stock. A forum community dedicated to vintage Ford Mustang owners and enthusiasts. $25 for AFR Heads???? Questions & Answers That's because in our combination, the 185 heads ran neck and neck with the smaller and supposedly torquier 165 heads up to 3,900 rpm plus a little, but from 4,000 rpm up to 5,800 rpm, where our camshaft had given up, the 185s exhibited a distinct advantage. David, where these port velocity numbers generated with a manifold in place? This is especially true of their cottage-like in-house foundry where the aluminum is hand-poured. AFR 185 flow numbers real? | Vintage Mustang Forums Reply HELP for help or STOP to opt out. Like the LS version, the SBF Enforcer features 8mm-stem, 2.020-inch-diameter stainless intake valves and 1.600-inch stainless exhaust valves in bronze valve guides. Copyright 2023. air flow research. While the AFR name is synonymous with amazing CNC-ported runners and combustion chambers, the company earned its reputation through knowledge of airflow. You are now signed up to receive JEGS Deals with text alerts! We should also note your choice of pedestal or bolt-down valvetrain hardware is available, too. THIS MEANS ANY PUBLIC PAVED OR UNPAVED ROADWAY OR IN A PUBLIC PARK. thick head deck makes the AFR heads ideal for nitrous or blower applications. AFR says the Competition Package is popular with the "insane power" street people running turbos and boasting power figures only racers dreamed about a decade ago. They were obtained at Westech, using a SuperFlow 901 engine dyno: Details & PricingAs noted in the main text, the 165 and 185 AFR heads are practically identical, save for the intake ports. Check the Fit, Estimated USA Ship Date: Today by David Vizard Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:41 am, Post The 185cc intake runner flows 262cfm at .700 inch of lift, and the 64cc exhaust runner flows 168cfm at the same lift. When I received the new heads the nightmare began. I'd definitely go with the 205 heads on a stroker motor. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. The valve remains 1.600-inch. by unfairlane Wed Mar 02, 2016 7:20 pm, Post I think the RPM that they get shifted at has a lot to do with it. $5 Off Your $100 Mobile App Purchase - Get the App. The 122cc combustion chamber houses a stainless 2.250-inch intake and a 1.880-inch exhaust valve, both in 11/32-inch stem diameter, riding in bronze valve guides. by David Vizard Sat Mar 05, 2016 9:55 am, Powered by phpBB Forum Software phpBB Limited, General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track. I'm running flat tops, zero decked on my TW170's and I had way over .100 of clearance with my cam of 512/533 lift. Decided that the AFR 185 was my favorite choice. Blueprint Engines SBF heads | Vintage Mustang Forums In the manufacturing world any manufacturer, regardless of the Nation it resides in, is only going to produce a product as nice as the buyer is willing to pay for. Close to my low- to no bucks project this: I may have forgotten to say but when the intake valve size/flow is lower then normal related to the exhaust as is the 1.9/1.6 combo this AFR head has, then the cam usually needs to be in at more advance than normal. Yes, most after market heads will outflow ported factory heads. That's because in our combination, the 185 heads ran neck and neck with the smaller and supposedly torquier 165 heads up to 3,900 rpm plus a little, but from 4,000 rpm up to 5,800 rpm, where. So the engine is about 430HP at the flywheel now. Here's my breakdown of costs just in case you're unaware of what you're getting into. As it happens these stock valve events are also way off for the stock heads. We used the same MAF and cold air parts. With lightweight 8mm, 2.020 in. They say this head works well with a stock-type piston and 1.900-inch intake valve, which turbos respond to. .006" per cc 54cc Max (from 58cc); 68cc Max (from 72cc); .009" per cc 48cc Max (from 58cc); 62cc Max (from 72cc). INTERNATIONAL Customer Options, Summit Racing Equipment SpeedCard Estimated to ship direct from manufacturer on 06/12/23, pending manufacturer availability. THESE PRODUCTS ARE ONLY LEGAL IF USED ON A DEDICATED RACING VEHICLE. The other looming question mark, rpm, is just like adding cubic inches. I want some of what you're smoking if I think that Chicom **** is real. I bought the AFR Enforcer heads I told you not to buy. We'd say anytime you have a stock camshaft and stock displacement in a 302/5.0 engine, the 165 heads are the best choice. 185cc SBF Enforcer Cylinder Head. 8mm Bead Lock Intake Valve 2.020" x 4.900" O.A.L. item 1 AFR 1351 SBF 185 Enforcer Cylinder Heads, Assembled AFR 1351 SBF 185 Enforcer Cylinder Heads, Assembled. Holding those springs in place is a set of steel 7-degree retainers and AFRs standard 7-degree 8mm valve locks. Choosing A Cylinder Head - Mustang 50 Magazine - MotorTrend With a 185cc intake runner size, the heads fall into the larger side of the 302-based street engine offerings while still being large enough to provide an upgrade in a 351 Windsor engine. While the exact specs on those parts will vary by application, their quality is assured. for the cam I'd use) and picked the heads with the most area under the curve (labeled "curve CFM" on my old spreadsheet). 8mm Bead Lock Exhaust Valve 1.600" x 4.950" O.A.L. Move up to a 347, and especially one with a bit of camming such as our mule, and you're in 185 territory. I also used a comp 282S SFT cam and 1.7 probe shaft rockers with beehive springs. We are fellow Americans, and that's an association that means more to me than any other." Buy once, cry once! 8mm Bead Lock Intake Valve, 2.020" x 5.000" Overall Valve Length, 8mm Bead Lock Exhaust Valve, 1.600" x 5.030" Overall Valve Length, PAC Racing Spring 1.290" OD Hydraulic Roller Dual Valve Spring, 140 lbs on seat, .600" maximum lift, Max RPM 6300-6500 (upgrades available), 7 Steel Retainers 1.245" O.D x .885" I.D x .655" I.D, Hardened Valve Spring O.D Locator 1.380" O.D x .570" I.D, SB Ford 1/2" Bolt Head Bolts, ARP #154-3603, SB Ford 1/2" Bolt Head Studs, ARP #254-4503, 1/2" Bolt - 7/16" Thread Head Bolts, 289/302W: ARP 254-3708. We've dyno-proven that all of this gear easily supports more power than we're looking at here, so none of it is a choke. AFR 165 or Trick Flow 170 would give you the best bang for your buck and. exhaust valves, combustion chamber volumes of 58 or 72cc, and 68cc exhaust ports, AFR's 185cc Ford cylinder heads are designed for 302-351 c.i.d. This budget-friendly cylinder head is. exhaust valves, combustion chamber volumes of 58 or 72cc, and 68cc exhaust ports, AFR's 185cc Ford cylinder . All Rights Reserved. Tracy Blackford, 65 Mustang FB, 331 built with 289 H beam rods and 383W piston, 282S cam, ported Promaxx 180 heads, Dougs Tri-Y headers. Since your shaft rockers are probably for an inline head, you're probably not going to be able go with TrickFlow. I would consider buying them from Ford Strokers as he usually sells them with upgraded springs. THESE PRODUCTS ARE ILLEGAL TO OPERATE ON ANY PUBLIC HIGHWAY. This website is using a security service to protect itself from online attacks. Spent the last several months reading the 8 part article in MM&FF on the head comparison. Part #1422 & 1492 are street legal in 50 states for 1995 and older emissions controlled vehicles under CARB EO #D-250-3. Likewise, the standard valves are good-quality street parts. Are these simply the original AFR heads? AFR Small Block Ford 185cc Renegade Street/Strip Aluminum Cylinder Heads, Bead Lock Intake Valve, 2.020'' x 4.903'' Overall Valve Length (Stud Mount Rocker Arms), Bead Lock Exhaust Valve, 1.600'' x 4.955'' Overall Valve Length (Stud Mount Rocker Arms), Bead Lock Intake Valve, 2.020'' x 5.079'' Overall Valve Length (Pedestal Mount Rocker Arms), Bead Lock Exhaust Valve, 1.600'' x 5.100'' Overall Valve Length (Pedestal Mount Rocker Arms), PAC Racing Valve Spring: 1.290'' OD Hydraulic Roller Dual Valve Spring, 135 lbs on seat, .600'' maximum lift, Thermactor Air Injector on Emissions Legal Heads Only, Standard 2'' Spacing Exhaust Bolt Pattern, Accepts Factory and Aftermarket Headers, Use 14mm x 3/4'' reach gasketed (NOT tapered) seat plugs. But, AFR is passing off ProComp's as their own to get a piece of the budget heads market. Like AFRs other SBC cylinder heads, the Enforcer is available in both straight and angled-plug configurations. ARP rocker studs, PAC Racing valvesprings, Viton valve seals, hardened spring cups, ductile-iron valve seats, machined locks, AFR guide plates, and AFRs stainless-steel valves are all included on the assembled heads. JEGS Memorial Day Savings - Up to $155 Off select JEGS Brand Products! 65 2+2, 331, C4 presently apart for complete a restore, 1979 Ford F150 custom, 302, C4, AC, tilt wheel, main transportation. The big-block Chevy Enforcer package is meant for big-flow, even with as-cast features, such as the 325cc intake ports (left), the 122cc combustion chamber with openings for 2.250-inch and 1.880-inch valves (center), and 140cc exhaust runner. Ask a Product Question. When is an engine too large for AFR 165 heads? Have you considered larger than 185s? Use commas to separate multiple addresses. Cloudflare Ray ID: 7d2bfe57ff651895 Instead AFR seems to be working on larger, racier Ford heads, as the current 165/185/202 heads make all the power anyone could possibly use/want/think, they want at the hot street or toy race car end of the market, while the serious racers always need more power and often can't use forced induction. 185cc SBF Street Cylinder Head - Air Flow Research View All Reviews, Some parts are not legal for use in California or other states with similar laws / regulations. How do these compare to the LMR 170 heads? Hardened pushrods required with cylinder heads p/n 033-1420 and 033-1422. Estimated to ship direct from manufacturer on 06/19/23, pending manufacturer availability. Also, piston compression height makes a difference so if you're running 1.585" pistons and have .070" quench to boot you also didn't do your homework. We made our own dyno numbers, of course. 500HP seems to be the limit give or take. The as-cast ports and chambers save a significant amount of production expense, while still performing better than an OEM or other budget cylinder head. With 140 pounds on the seat, it is good for .600 inch of maximum lift and 6,500 rpm, which is about the most a typical street-based hydraulic-roller or solid-flat-tappet Windsor engine will see. AFR's Enforcer Cylinder Heads Raise The Bar For Budget - EngineLabs The Fora platform includes forum software by XenForo. All rights reserved. There's a good reason why I have them. Cylinder Head, 185cc Enforcer, Aluminum, Assembled, 64cc Combustion Chamber, 2.020 in. You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post. Initially offered in four fitments small-block Chevy, cathedral-port LS1, big-block Chevy, and small-block Ford the heads do share some features across the line. Maybe just another option to look into: 185cc SBF Enforcer Cylinder Head by mag2555 Wed Mar 02, 2016 6:34 am, Post In fact, we figured the heads were machined from the same casting, and while AFR says it is possible to whittle a 185 head from a 165 casting, that's not the way the company does it. AFR 165 or Trick Flow 170 would give you the best bang for your buck and you won't run into piston to valve clearance issues. AFR recommends the use of .120" thick-wall pushrods. Sold in Pairs, 2/pkg. You can order this part by Contacting Us. Whether you are building a whole new engine, or just trying to add some power to your current project car, cylinder heads are a crucial component. Assuming you have a non-roller block, if you want to upgrade to a roller cam, you're going to have to shell out some cash for tie-bar lifters. See if you Prequalify. The bare No Parts version of the LS Enforcer head will carry the part number 1502, while the fully assembled version will be P/N: 1501. PTP Engineering front suspension and 25540R17s all around. They're generally considered among the best. Such engines are typically exhaust strangled, so the Comp Package is a good fit for them. AFR's 1351 185cc SBF Enforcer Cylinder heads feature AFR's Permanent Mold "As-Cast" Technology surfaces on the intake runners, exhaust runners and combustion chambers that allows for extremely accurate and repeatable port location/performance. Since we know everyone in the LS world is going to ask how and why these heads are better than the best OEM cathedral-port cylinder heads, we decided to pose that exact question toTorrecarion directly. Only experience I have is AFR Renegade heads. They are listed as "LS1" heads, as they require a minimum 3.900-inch bore, so 4.8L/5.3L-bore engines need not apply. The 210cc intake runner flows 262cfm at .600 inch of lift, while the 82cc exhaust runner flows 207cfm at the same .600 inch of lift which is better than 243/799 flow numbers weve seen, on both sides of the head. The Ultimate Bolt-On Emission Legal Street/Strip Weapon! I love how we can have a civil conversation about this topic. T5z and 3.89 9" TL rear. Upgrading the springs only is $60. Please see footnotes for additional information. By subscribing to JEGS SMS, you consent to receive autodialed messages to the number used at opt-in. edelbrock heads vs. afr heads | Team Camaro Tech Recommended for engines from 302-393 cubic inches, operating up to 6000-6500 RPM. 159.223.159.251 4.25 out of 5 stars These heads are similar to each other, and from a practical level, differ only in their intake ports and intake valve sizes. Airflow Research developed these 185cc SBF Enforcer cylinder heads for maximum small block Ford performance. They come fully assembled with the identical components found in our higher end CNC ported cylinder heads; such as ARP rockers studs, PAC Racing springs, viton valve seals, AFR adjustable guide plates, machined bead valve locks (not stamped), hardened spring cups and our one piece 8mm 21 4N Stainless Steel valves. Here is the specs of the Renegade AFR heads the produced 410 lbs-ft of torque and 431 hp from 306 inch (0.030 bore) using a 270 hyd roller cam and pump gas for fuel. View Details. AFR's 185cc SBF Enforcer Cylinder heads feature our Permanent Mold As-Cast Technology surfaces on the intake runners, exhaust runners and combustion chambers that allows for extremely accurate and repeatable port location/performance. AFR's 185cc "Street" cylinder heads feature 100% CNC ported intake, exhaust & chambers, A356 aluminum castings and high quality components throughout. When we finally got down to running the two heads, we found the 165 vs. 185 head contest dead-simple to analyze.
